Facebook Activity



Teen Ink on Twitter

Home > Forums > Teen Ink Forums > Philosophy and Thought > Anyone else out there that cant make up their mind about religion?

Teen Ink Forums

Lively discussions with other teens
   
Next thread » « Previous thread

Anyone else out there that cant make up their mind about religion?

mollybug13This teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. posted this thread...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 12:11 am

So my whole family is christian so ive grown up going to church and reading the Bible, the very first verse I learned was Genesis 1:1 " In the beginning God created the Heaven and the Earth" but now I kind of haveing a hard time accepting God. I keep questioning how is He there? I dont know if that makes sense. Does anyone else feel this way?

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
CollinF replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 12:21 am

Karl Barth once wrote, "Dount is not the opposite of faith: doubt is an element of faith."
 
It's natural to question: otherwise you'd never grow in your faith. But actively seek answers to your qualms. Don't let them fester or they become unhealthy to your spiritual life.
 
Anything specific I can help ya with, bud? 
 
:) *

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
Destinee replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 12:24 am

Holler :) Welcome to TI. It's lovely to have you here and this is a great thread. Very honest. :)
 
Yes. I've been raised Muslim, and in fact I am quite resigned to the existence of God, but I am continuously questioning the veracity of religion. It is a hard road, my friend, but "verily, with hardship comes ease" (to quote the Qur'an). 
 
All great minds question. (not referring to mine, lol, but in general.) At the start of every journey is an unsteady step. So don't feel alone - usually greatness is scattered. ;) 
 
This forum is great because people routinely discuss God. (And by routinely I mean always. haha) So you will definitely be at home here :)
 
Do you know what problems/doubts you have with God in particular?  
 
* < if you wanna know what that means, check out my Hear Ye, Hear Ye thread. (Shamelessly promoting my own idea. LOL.)

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
Destinee replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 12:24 am

AWWW YES COLLIN DID THE * THING :D 
 
#Happiness. * 

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
Quantum1.0This teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 12:31 am

I'm definitely with you on this. I'm too tired to bring any great insight at the moment, but I just wanted to say that I understand. I'm coming at it from the other side - in that I've never been a Christian, but I've been testing the ideas recently. I went to a church service the other day for like the fourth time in my life and for the rest of the day it felt like my primal, emotional self was fighting my rational self. I value my rational mind greatly though, so I doubt I'll ever be able to believe in God, but that question is definitely a normal thing. 
 
*

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
mollybug13This teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 1:25 am

I have been really questioning how is God real, like you know how everything is created. How was God created, how is He there. I dont know if that makes sense but thats what goes through my mind every Sunday.

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
Jade.I.AmThis teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 7:26 am

Hi Molly. I'll get to this later, I'm in school :P I think I originally came to TI simply to distract me when I should be studying...jk......maybe.......anyways, yeah XD

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
readaholicThis teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 8:39 am

I can't pretend to understand how God was created, but I honestly think that it's more comprehensible to think that the universe, Earth, and people were made by a higher power than just suddenly appearing.  I can't believe that this was all a mistake.

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
Aug. 27, 2013 at 1:05 pm

Readaholic: Sorry to be nitpicky, but God wasn't created. He just was. God justis.

"In the beginning was the Word" (John 1:1)

He was there in the beginning. Implying that he existed before the beginning.

MollyBug: It's okay to doubt sometimes, as long as you're still searching for the truth.
"Doubt is a pain too lonely to know that faith is his twin brother." Khalil Gibran

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
Jade.I.AmThis teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 1:06 pm

Yeah, that's what I was gonna focus on—god was never "created." He's always existed.

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
Breece6This teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 1:25 pm

I definitely can't make up my mind -_-
 
But I think regardless, the act of going out and seeking for answers is certainly the right thing to do.  
 
Never be content with what you don't know.  :)

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
Destinee replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 3:18 pm

Mollybug: 
 
Hey thanks for your reply :)
 
'I have been really questioning how is God real, like you know how everything is created. How was God created, how is He there. I dont know if that makes sense but thats what goes through my mind every Sunday."
 
Have you tried talking to your priest/pastor? They know the answers to these questions :) Seriously. :) 
 
Anyway. Glad you asked mon amie. 
 
God is not created. God is pre-eternal. He is self-sustaining. 
 
Think about it. Why do we think things are created? (1) Because they appear to have some degree of complexity & purpose that we find hard to believe could have come about unintentionally/blindly (2) Because everything we know of has a beginning, i.e. everything we know of started sometime and will end sometime; nothing exists solely because of itself. You and I, we depend on food to survive. Food depends on crops, which depend on the sun, which depends on the continual chemical reactions as well as gravitational pull, etc etc. Everything is dependent on something else. This is called contingency (vs necessary). (3) Everything natural appears to have had a cause.
 
Based on (1), God doesn't need a creator. We haven't observed God. We don't know His complexity. Complexity is a function of disunity, or of multiple parts. For instance, my computer is quite complex. There are numerous parts - the keys, the screens, the transitors, wires, plugs, etc - all interact with one another to give us complexity. Anything we observe is made up of smaller parts. Plants are made of leaves and stems, in turn made of xylem, in turn made of cells, in turn made of chloroplasts, etc etc. Finding the smallest part - the essence of all matter - is the goal of quantum physics. On a macroscopic (and even microscopic) level everything is congruent, but varied, and interacting. God, on the other hand, is one. He is an essence. That is what He is, and that is all, but that is everything. That is why His essence considered beyond human understanding - because such unity is virtually impossible for us to reason about. How do you reason about something totally unique? You can only make superficial or analogous statements. That is also why descriptions of God, explanations of God, all depend on Him creating. We can analyse His behaviour (assuming you think He exists). 
 
Based on 2), all of our induction/reasoning about contingency are based on observation. But we can only observe the natural. Natural things appear to be contingent. To say that as a result, the supernatural cannot be self-subsisting is a leap. 
 
Based on 3) how do we know causes exist? Why do we think they exist? First off, causality is a notion that arises from thought. It is not directly observed in nature. It is an inference. Why does it arise? Because we see things in terms of sequenced events. This happens, then that happens. We cannot comprehend that something happens without a cause. Our minds refuse to accept it. When you see a tree, you do not say, "Oh a tree. Cool." and move on with your life. What you say is, "Oh a tree, where did it come from? Oh the seed, why did that grow? Oh because of the water, soil, sunshine, whatever." 
 
To say that something came from nothing is another thing the mind rejects. No thing means 0. It means absence of EVERYTHING. To think something came from nothing is unimaginable, because who knows what nothing looks like? To see we need photons, which obviously would not exist in nothing.
 
Now, does God need a cause? That is the question. Well, time is a necessary factor in cause and effect. The effect cannot exist prior to the cause. Does God exist in time? No. He is pre-eternal. He is before eternity itself. So does He need a cause? Not really. 
 
*

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
Izuo.This teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 3:23 pm

I think that we can never truly know whether God exists or not when we are alive. The only way we'll be able to discern whether he exists or not is if we die, or we see angels or an event that proves God's existence. I for one believe in God and I do have my doubts about him too. 
 
Breece:
 
"Never be content with what you don't know"
 
Ignorance is bliss. 

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
readaholicThis teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 4:03 pm

RandbowsandStormClouds (and pretty much everyone who posted afterwards):  Now that I reread my post, I'm kicking myself.  I knew that, too, but I was just being...stupid, so thanks for waking up my smarticals :)

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
half.noteThis teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 6:18 pm

Okay, I probably use this Ellen White quote way too much on this forum, but it applies perfectly here:
 
"God never asks us to believe, without giving sufficient evidence upon which to base our faith. His existence, His character, the truthfulness of His word, are all established by testimony that appeals to our reason; and this testimony is abundant. Yet God has never removed the possibility of doubt. Our faith must rest upon evidence, not demonstration. Those who wish to doubt will have opportunity; while those who really desire to know the truth will find plenty of evidence on which to rest their faith." (Steps to Christ, pg. 105)
 
I suggest reading the whole chapter. It's called "What to do with Doubt". It may help. :)
 
here's the link:
w ww.whiteestate.o rg/books/sc/sc12.html
 
If you have any questions don't hesitate to ask.
 
God bless. ♥

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
mollybug13This teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 6:51 pm

Thanks, ill check out that chapter now. *

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
stuntddudeThis teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 8:11 pm

Molly:
 
Just saying, certain people here *intense stare at those certain people* will do what they can to indoctrinate you. Be sure to question everything that anyone (and yes, that includes myself) says on this site. Also question anything that someone here links to. In fact, just never forget to question things in general. Don't believe anything just because someone or something told you.
 
RainbowsandStormClouds:
 
"Yeah, that's what I was gonna focus on—god was never "created." He's always existed."
 
Why not save a step, and conclude that the universe always existed? ;)
 
Destinee:
 
"But we can only observe the natural. [...] To say that as a result, the supernatural cannot be self-subsisting is a leap."
 
To be fair - to conclude that the supernatural exists, if as you say we can't observe it, is an even greater leap.

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
half.noteThis teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 9:30 pm

*feels stuntddude staring intensely at her*
 
Yes, I know I'm probably one of the people you're staring at. :P
 
To be fair, though, what else am I supposed to tell her?
"Yes, that's good. Doubt God. Become an agnostic or athesit."
 
:P
 
I believe that God is real and that my beliefs concerning him are true, so of course I am going to try and help her get her faith back. It's hardly "indoctrination." 
 
Of course, I do agree with your general point. It's good to question, especially what other fallible humans are telling you.
 
God bless. ♥

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
half.noteThis teenager is a 'regular' and has contributed a lot of work, comments and/or forum posts, and has received many votes and high ratings over a long period of time. replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 9:33 pm

Oh, and one more thing, stunt:
 
Why not save a step, and conclude that the universe always existed?
 
Simple: everything in our universe has a beginning and end. Therefore something outside of our universe without beginning or end (God) had to create our universe.
 
God bless. ♥

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread
Destinee replied...
Aug. 27, 2013 at 10:05 pm

SDD: 
 
"To be fair - to conclude that the supernatural exists, if as you say we can't observe it, is an even greater leap."
 
Not really. You can't tehcnically observe causality, representation, or any number of things. This is {according to the argument} a logical  step.

Reply to this Thread Post a new Thread

Launch Teen Ink Chat
Site Feedback