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Matt replied...
Aug. 23, 2004 at 11:39 am

Quote:
Originally posted by Ticklipple
Edit: alcohol makes me poor at choosing the words that I mean.

Nice.

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HeraldMage replied...
Aug. 29, 2004 at 5:50 am

Thanx heaps Thomas. Even though I feel like I am back in Mrs. Avery's 5th grade class. It does come in quite handy.

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_Brookhaven_ replied...
Oct. 16, 2004 at 5:00 am

Quote:
Originally posted by IAmTheWalrus
This desperately needed to be created. Thank you, Tom.
Though of course a good majority just don't know how to write in proper English, many others don't because they think it's cool to " type tha way thats representativitive of miself ya no?"

God i hate it. Of course the only problem is that many people can't comprehend what you said. They see something that reminds them of school and that's the end of that.


Though some will read it. Thank you for doing this. Now if only we had one of these in every forum...


Thank you, thank you. I HATE it when people write like that.

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Super_Kitty replied...
Dec. 28, 2004 at 1:59 am

Quote:
Originally posted by Ticklipple
REALLY BASIC RULES OF GRAMMAR

This really ought to apply to all fora, but I should think that it's most important in this forum.

1. Capital letters begin sentences, full stops or 'periods' (.) end them. This is something learned at a very primary level of learning, there's no real excuse to ignore this rule. Some punctuation can perform the same task as a full stop: exclamation marks (!) and question marks (?) being two of the most common. Other punctuation serves to help the sentence flow and to prevent confusion as to the meaning of the sentence: commas (,) and semi-colons (;) are examples of this type of punctuation.

Colons (:) are often put into both categories: as you can see in this sentence, it is serving the role of dividing up the sentence (into statement and explanation). However, it can also be used to end a sentence. An example:

This is the example. Note, however, how I started a new paragraph. This is generally accepted etiquette.

After ANY mark of punctuation (excluding apostrophes, hyphens (-) and brackets) you MUST put a space. This helps to make it more legible, and makes the writing seem less run-together. There is, however, not a gap (usually) between a punctuation mark and the word immediately preceding it.

2. Paragraphing is virtually essentially in any writing longer than approximately 3 sentences. It helps to divide writing up into sections for a reader to embrace, rather than be bogged down by enormous chunks of writing.

3. While the ellipsis (...) could have been placed in rule 1, there is so much abuse of it that it merits its own rule. An ellipsis can be used to divide up a sentence. HOWEVER, it should not be used as a complete substitute for full stops and proper sentence structure. There is some degree of flexibility with regards to an author's intent - sometimes it is essential that the writing be altered in such a fashion. On these boards, though, it tends to suggest incompetence rather than artistic license. My suggestion: stick to decent, normal structure. By all means splash out on an ellipsis every so often, and by all means use it for its alter-ego as a quote binder, but don't fill your work with it.

4. The apostrophe (') is an abused mark, and doesn't deserve it, considering its valiant work.


In most cases, the apostrophe is designed to show possession. Refer to my easy-to-use guide to learn how!

a) Look at the ending. Does the noun end in an 's'? If so, go to b). If not, is it a pronoun (i.e. me, you, he, she, it, us, they)? If so, go to c). If not, place an apostrophe followed by an 's' after the noun.

Examples:
Cat -> cat's

translation: 'of the cat'


Children -> children's
translation: 'of the children'

b) Here ground becomes slightly tricky. Grammar obviously changes with time, and the 'correct' way is often the commonly accepted rule. Usually, you'll be safe with placing an apostrophe after the 's'.

Examples:
Kiss -> kiss'

translation: 'of the kiss'


Kisses -> kisses'
translation: 'of the kisses'

However, it's my understanding that the current rule is to place an 's' afterwards as well, just as you would normally. At the moment, then, I'd say that either use is acceptable, though my personal preference is for the former.

c) The mistake concerning the use of the apostrophe with 'it' is extremely common. The word 'it' does not apply to the usual rules, because of the extremely common contraction of 'it is' to 'it's'. To prevent confusion, when you wish to convey possession of an 'it', you do not use an apostrophe, and leave it in its virgin form of 'its'.

Examples:
If I read any more bad grammar it's going to kill me.


The bear is up to its neck in stolen picnics.

That wasn't so hard, was it?

The rest of the pronouns are somewhat similar. The difference is that in order to avoid confusion with the contraction, they have changed the root word rather than removed the apostrophe.




Normal





Possessive form




Me --->







My*
You --->






Your*
He ---->






His
She ---->






Her*
It ----->






Its
Us ----->






Our*
They --->






Their*


* This is only the case for these if they are describing a noun. If it is a main noun then it becomes:

Me --->






Mine
Your --->






Yours
She --->






Hers
Us --->






Ours
They --->






Theirs

Examples:

This is my stapler. The stapler is mine.
That is your baby. The baby is yours.
That was his DNA. The DNA was his.
It is her decision. The decision is hers.
**The Chihuahua washed its fur. Its fur was washed.
I cannot find our son. The son is ours.
I am dancing on their roof. The roof is theirs.

** You never finish a sentence with 'its' or 'it's'. It just sounds horrible, don't do it.



Feel free to print that out and stick it above your computer.


Apostrophes also serve as contractions, hence the above problems. A contraction is simply where you miss out a letter or letters and replace them with an apostrophe.

Common examples:











Do not -> Don't



Will not -> Won't



Shall not -> Shan't



Would not -> Wouldn't



Can not -> Can't



Could not -> Couldn't



I am
-> I'm



He is
-> He's



She is
-> She's



You are -> You're



They are -> They're



5. 'They're', 'their' and 'there' are commonly confused. While I have detailed the difference between 'their' and 'they're', I'll go through the three again.

There: A place which is not here. Also used in narration to mean 'in existence'. E.g. 'There once was a frog.'

Their: Describing possession of something belonging to 'them'.

They're: A contraction of 'they are'.

Now there's really no excuse to confuse them.

6. As the old rhyme goes, 'I before E except after C'. This isn't a perfect rule by any means, but the number of times that 'receive' or 'grief' are spelled incorrectly warrants this.

7. Capitalise the first letter of the word of every sentence, and of ALL PROPER NOUNS. It is also important to capitalise 'I'. Proper nouns are place names (e.g. Transylvania), or names of people (e.g. Flash Gordon). After this, capitalise only for emphasis. Don't overdo it, for the reader's sake.

Is everybody quite clear now? There are several other things that this could include, but I felt that only the very basic grammar rules ought to be detailed, for the moment at least.



Why are you posting this? Are you bored or something? I could probably use some work on my grammar though.

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Karen replied...
Dec. 28, 2004 at 5:36 pm

He posted it because many people think that it's okay to ignore correct grammar when posting, when in fact this is a board about teen writing, and people should at keast attempt to write correctly!

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Super_Kitty replied...
Dec. 28, 2004 at 10:34 pm

Oh I see.

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Beans16 replied...
Jan. 5, 2005 at 11:52 pm

Wow, sir or ma'am. You seem to be very touchy about correct grammar usage. What you have failed to realize, however, is that while some find your intellect impressive, as do I, most simply find it annoying. If they do not yet know how to use correct grammar at the age of 13 (or whatever the youngest age allowed on this site may be), they probably simply do not care, nor will they attempt to use it correctly. I myself have tried to no avail to correct the grammar of my peers. It just simply cannot be done. Those that care will use it properly; those that do not, plainly will not. Good luck anyways!

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Karen replied...
Jan. 6, 2005 at 9:31 am

It cannot hurt to remind people. Sheesh, I've been having grammar lessons in school (the same ones, it seems) since, like, 4th grade. While 13-year-olds (or anyone else) might not be perefct, they should at least try!

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Beans16 replied...
Jan. 7, 2005 at 11:06 pm

Ahhh Karen... yes I too enjoy the delight of said grammar lessons. However, like I stated before, no matter how often you remind people of their bad grammar, they still wont listen to you and will only get annoyed with you because you do so. Also, I'm sure that not many people that actually NEED the grammar reminder will even bother to read at such length how poor their grammar is.

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Little_Skittle replied...
Jan. 8, 2005 at 12:30 am

Quote:
Originally posted by Beans16
Ahhh Karen... yes I too enjoy the delight of said grammar lessons. However, like I stated before, no matter how often you remind people of their bad grammar, they still wont listen to you and will only get annoyed with you because you do so. Also, I'm sure that not many people that actually NEED the grammar reminder will even bother to read at such length how poor their grammar is.

You act as if you're one of them. Many grammarians are touchy about the fact that so many teens in North America can't seem to speak their own language properly. Is it their fault that people will become annoyed? No. It's the fault of lazy teens.

The fact that it's there is good enough.

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coloradogirl replied...
Apr. 5, 2005 at 11:04 pm

Wow! I did not know that...

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TestSonal replied...
May 5, 2005 at 11:41 am

test reply

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MADEDITOR replied...
Jul. 8, 2005 at 10:22 pm

Tom, you are going to heaven with shoes and all! By the way are you the same Tom that is the webmaster for myspace.com?
:D

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Ticklipple replied...
Jul. 17, 2005 at 6:17 pm

No, but we do occasionally meet up at Toms Anonymous.

..It's not so anonymous, to be honest.

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Broken__ replied...
Nov. 12, 2005 at 10:25 am

Wow, what my younger brother learns.
But then, some of the people on here need it. Great work; I really enjoyed recapping my grammar skills, especially when I'm in a country that speaks next to no English at all.

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J'aimeleshommes replied...
Feb. 21, 2006 at 12:22 pm

Quote:
Originally posted by Ticklipple
REALLY BASIC RULES OF GRAMMAR

This really ought to apply to all fora, but I should think that it's most important in this forum.

1. Capital letters begin sentences, full stops or 'periods' (.) end them. This is something learned at a very primary level of learning, there's no real excuse to ignore this rule. Some punctuation can perform the same task as a full stop: exclamation marks (!) and question marks (?) being two of the most common. Other punctuation serves to help the sentence flow and to prevent confusion as to the meaning of the sentence: commas (,) and semi-colons (;) are examples of this type of punctuation.

Colons (:) are often put into both categories: as you can see in this sentence, it is serving the role of dividing up the sentence (into statement and explanation). However, it can also be used to end a sentence. An example:

This is the example. Note, however, how I started a new paragraph. This is generally accepted etiquette.

After ANY mark of punctuation (excluding apostrophes, hyphens (-) and brackets) you MUST put a space. This helps to make it more legible, and makes the writing seem less run-together. There is, however, not a gap (usually) between a punctuation mark and the word immediately preceding it.

2. Paragraphing is virtually essentially in any writing longer than approximately 3 sentences. It helps to divide writing up into sections for a reader to embrace, rather than be bogged down by enormous chunks of writing.

3. While the ellipsis (...) could have been placed in rule 1, there is so much abuse of it that it merits its own rule. An ellipsis can be used to divide up a sentence. HOWEVER, it should not be used as a complete substitute for full stops and proper sentence structure. There is some degree of flexibility with regards to an author's intent - sometimes it is essential that the writing be altered in such a fashion. On these boards, though, it tends to suggest incompetence rather than artistic license. My suggestion: stick to decent, normal structure. By all means splash out on an ellipsis every so often, and by all means use it for its alter-ego as a quote binder, but don't fill your work with it.

4. The apostrophe (') is an abused mark, and doesn't deserve it, considering its valiant work.


In most cases, the apostrophe is designed to show possession. Refer to my easy-to-use guide to learn how!

a) Look at the ending. Does the noun end in an 's'? If so, go to b). If not, is it a pronoun (i.e. me, you, he, she, it, us, they)? If so, go to c). If not, place an apostrophe followed by an 's' after the noun.

Examples:
Cat -> cat's

translation: 'of the cat'


Children -> children's
translation: 'of the children'

b) Here ground becomes slightly tricky. Grammar obviously changes with time, and the 'correct' way is often the commonly accepted rule. Usually, you'll be safe with placing an apostrophe after the 's'.

Examples:
Kiss -> kiss'

translation: 'of the kiss'


Kisses -> kisses'
translation: 'of the kisses'

However, it's my understanding that the current rule is to place an 's' afterwards as well, just as you would normally. At the moment, then, I'd say that either use is acceptable, though my personal preference is for the former.

c) The mistake concerning the use of the apostrophe with 'it' is extremely common. The word 'it' does not apply to the usual rules, because of the extremely common contraction of 'it is' to 'it's'. To prevent confusion, when you wish to convey possession of an 'it', you do not use an apostrophe, and leave it in its virgin form of 'its'.

Examples:
If I read any more bad grammar it's going to kill me.


The bear is up to its neck in stolen picnics.

That wasn't so hard, was it?

The rest of the pronouns are somewhat similar. The difference is that in order to avoid confusion with the contraction, they have changed the root word rather than removed the apostrophe.




Normal





Possessive form




Me --->







My*
You --->






Your*
He ---->






His
She ---->






Her*
It ----->






Its
Us ----->






Our*
They --->






Their*


* This is only the case for these if they are describing a noun. If it is a main noun then it becomes:

Me --->






Mine
Your --->






Yours
She --->






Hers
Us --->






Ours
They --->






Theirs

Examples:

This is my stapler. The stapler is mine.
That is your baby. The baby is yours.
That was his DNA. The DNA was his.
It is her decision. The decision is hers.
**The Chihuahua washed its fur. Its fur was washed.
I cannot find our son. The son is ours.
I am dancing on their roof. The roof is theirs.

** You never finish a sentence with 'its' or 'it's'. It just sounds horrible, don't do it.



Feel free to print that out and stick it above your computer.


Apostrophes also serve as contractions, hence the above problems. A contraction is simply where you miss out a letter or letters and replace them with an apostrophe.

Common examples:











Do not -> Don't



Will not -> Won't



Shall not -> Shan't



Would not -> Wouldn't



Can not -> Can't



Could not -> Couldn't



I am
-> I'm



He is
-> He's



She is
-> She's



You are -> You're



They are -> They're



5. 'They're', 'their' and 'there' are commonly confused. While I have detailed the difference between 'their' and 'they're', I'll go through the three again.

There: A place which is not here. Also used in narration to mean 'in existence'. E.g. 'There once was a frog.'

Their: Describing possession of something belonging to 'them'.

They're: A contraction of 'they are'.

Now there's really no excuse to confuse them.

6. As the old rhyme goes, 'I before E except after C'. This isn't a perfect rule by any means, but the number of times that 'receive' or 'grief' are spelled incorrectly warrants this.

7. Capitalise the first letter of the word of every sentence, and of ALL PROPER NOUNS. It is also important to capitalise 'I'. Proper nouns are place names (e.g. Transylvania), or names of people (e.g. Flash Gordon). After this, capitalise only for emphasis. Don't overdo it, for the reader's sake.

Is everybody quite clear now? There are several other things that this could include, but I felt that only the very basic grammar rules ought to be detailed, for the moment at least.




Ticklipple, can you explain object pronouns to me?

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Ganymede replied...
Feb. 21, 2006 at 12:34 pm

What do you want to know about them? They're fairly simple; once you understand the division of subject and object in a sentence and the idea of pronouns in general, then there's not a lot more to know

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LukasSnart replied...
Feb. 21, 2006 at 3:48 pm

God's. I feel like i am back in the classroom. :( I am sorry Tom if i have not been proper. I promise to do better in the future. :p

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Ticklipple replied...
Feb. 21, 2006 at 4:56 pm

Object pronouns are very similar to subject pronouns. In the same way that in the sentence:

'James picked up the cranberries.'

'James' can be replaced with 'he' once 'James' is known, just as 'cranberries' be replaced with 'them'.

So, once both are known,

'He picked up the cranberries'

is an example of a subject pronoun, whereas

'James picked them up' is an example of an object pronoun.

Essentially, it's about replacing the object (generally accusative) of the sentence with a word that saves you typing out the whole thing: it, them, their, etc.

Anyway, this thread embarrasses me, because I've been painfully prescriptive. Sorry, everyone.

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J'aimeleshommes replied...
Feb. 21, 2006 at 7:36 pm

No, but in english. Let's say we are getting into the more complex thoughts that can be expressed in the English language, like a complex sentence, how would you go about figuring out the object noun in the sentence.


*I don't think I am explaining myself well so...

"The car hit the man" is an example of object nouns, how would you figure out the object noun in a more complex sentence?


2*I mixed up my French with my English.

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